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... And Justice For All · Joined: 27 Oct 2008 Posts: 58

Lockerbie bomber applies for bail :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_new...and/south_of_scotland/7700927.stm

Latest News on Megrahi :

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en...r+Al+Megrahi&btnG=Search+News

Dignity and Justice for All of Us ... including all those Scottish nationals, those victims of injustice, currently suffering under Scotland's greatly discredited justice system

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When injustice becomes law, rebellion and protest becomes duty

Justice Is Lost, Justice Is Raped, Justice Is Gone. Pulling Your Strings, Justice Is Done. Seeking No Truth, Winning Is All... In Scotland's "Justice" System

kevin donald · Joined: 29 Oct 2007 Posts: 198

Phone in today 09.00 till 12.00. Friday 31/10/08

Good morning Scotland on the case of Al-Magrahi.

Should he be released.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/118901.stm

scotkaz · Joined: 28 Aug 2008 Posts: 527

"Little doubt" that Megrahi qualifies for bail

Following the announcement last night (Thursday evening) that Abdelbaset Ali Mohmad Al Megrahi has applied for interim liberation, Professor Robert Black says that Megrahi will almost certainly quaify for bail, to which statutory provisions apply, usually interpreted through the filter of Lord Wheatley's guidelines.

"The traditional approach of the High Court to the granting of bail pending an appeal is set out in guidelines issued by Lord Justice Clerk Wheatley in 1984 who stated that “it is not for [the judge considering bail] to pre-empt the decision of the Court of Criminal Appeal [on the appeal itself]," Black says on his online blog on the case developments.

"Accordingly if there are grounds of appeal which ex facie would warrant the quashing of the conviction if sustained, in such circumstances interim liberation should be granted. There can be little doubt that this test is satisfied in Abdelbaset Megrahi’s case. Not only have voluminous grounds of appeal been lodged which, if sustained, would lead to the quashing of the conviction; but also an independent review body, the Scottish Criminal Cases Review Commission, has reported that the conviction may have constituted a miscarriage of justice."

Professor Black's full assessment can be read below.

"The relevant statutory provision relating to the granting of bail to convicted prisoners pending an appeal is section 112 of the Criminal Procedure (Scotland) Act 1995, the relevant portions of which read:

“(1)… the High Court may, if it thinks fit, on the application of a convicted person, admit him to bail pending the determination of … his appeal.

“(2) The High Court shall not admit a convicted person to bail unless (a) the application for bail … states reasons why it should be granted … and (b) the prosecutor has had an opportunity to be heard on the application.”

The traditional approach of the High Court to the granting of bail pending an appeal is set out in guidelines issued by Lord Justice Clerk Wheatley in 1984 who stated that “it is not for [the judge considering bail] to pre-empt the decision of the Court of Criminal Appeal [on the appeal itself]. Accordingly if there are grounds of appeal which ex facie would warrant the quashing of the conviction if sustained, in such circumstances interim liberation should be granted.”

There can be little doubt that this test is satisfied in Abdelbaset Megrahi’s case. Not only have voluminous grounds of appeal been lodged which, if sustained, would lead to the quashing of the conviction; but also an independent review body, the Scottish Criminal Cases Review Commission, has reported that the conviction may have constituted a miscarriage of justice.

The Crown has on occasion sought to argue that a convicted prisoner should be released on bail pending his appeal only in exceptional circumstances. This argument was decisively rejected by the Criminal Appeal Court in the case of Ogilvie, Petitioner 1998 SCCR 187.

Other factors that may be relevant to the court’s decision in Mr Megrahi’s case are (1) the delay to which he has been subjected while his application was in the hands of the SCCRC and since his case was returned to the High Court; and (2) the information that has recently become public about the grave state of his health.

The court normally, though not invariably, does not reserve judgement but announces its decision at the end of the hearing."

Source: http://www.thefirmmagazine.com/ne...t_Megrahi_qualifies_for_bail.html
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Great Spirit, grant that I may not criticize my neighbor until I have walked a mile in his moccasins." - Old Native American Indian Prayer that my dad taught me.

... And Justice For All · Joined: 27 Oct 2008 Posts: 58

Should he be released. [?]

The families of most American victims who are convinced of his guilt would certainly not be happy if he is released ... and I doubt he is on their cards of good wishes list either.

Chances are he will be bail released next Thursday on compassionate grounds and all his well-known supporters, many with their own agendas of course, will continue to claim "the worst miscarriage in Scottish history" has been perpetrated on this poor foreign national and he deserves all the support, compassion and best of medical care Scotland has to offer. Maybe so.

If only those who are as quick to get on the Megrahi bandwagon, usually jumping on board with their own self-serving and self-promoting agendas as I say, were as quick to condemn and shout about all those other alleged miscarriages of justice, and the other well-known injustices in Scotland today, then perhaps I would be less indifferent and cynical about the whole sorry affair.

Until those who shout loud for Megrahi shout as loud for others in Scotland who have suffered, and continue to suffer, at the murky hands of Scotland's beleaguered and discredited justice system, then I will probably remain as indifferent and cynical towards the whole thing. And I'm sure there are many out there who hold that view too.

I will of course think of the 270 souls who perished in the Lockerbie atrocity on the day of the 20th Anniversary, Sunday 21 December 2008.

Latest News on Megrahi :

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en...r+Al+Megrahi&btnG=Search+News

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Dignity and Justice for All of Us ... including all those Scottish nationals, those many unseen victims of injustice, currently suffering under Scotland's greatly discredited justice system

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Given the circumstances, there are many who believe it appropriate for the Libyan to be released early, so he can spend his last days with his wife and children. The law, quite correctly, allows the early release of prisoners who face imminent death. There are some, however, who the public would never tolerate releasing, even on humanitarian grounds, such as West and Huntley. But if Megrahi is guilty, then why should his terrible murders be seen as less serious than their terrible murders? It is easier to be compassionate if you think the man is innocent. Some individuals, including Tam Dalyell MP, describe him as a quiet, cultured man who is incapable of such a ghastly act. I do seem to remember the late Lord Longford saying something similar about the child killer Myra Hindley. Nobody paid much attention.

For the moment, Megrahi is a convicted child killer — the youngest person on PanAm 103 was nine months old. Many, including the families of most American victims, are convinced of his guilt. The families have, after all, received millions of dollars of compensation from Gaddafi, his employer. This leaves a terrible taste. If Megrahi, an intelligence agent, placed the bomb, it was at the command of a president who is now our new best friend.

Source :

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/article5013750.ece
_________________
When injustice becomes law, rebellion and protest becomes duty

Justice Is Lost, Justice Is Raped, Justice Is Gone. Pulling Your Strings, Justice Is Done. Seeking No Truth, Winning Is All... In Scotland's "Justice" System

W.Roughead · Joined: 25 Oct 2008 Posts: 120 Location: Scotland.

If released he has stated several times that he wishes to remain in Scotland.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/article5058451.ece
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“Send not to know for whom the bell tolls – it tolls for thee.” John Donne.

scotkaz · Joined: 28 Aug 2008 Posts: 527

The Megrahi I know
Tam Dalyell

If I thought for one moment that Abdul Baset Ali al-Megrahi had been in any way involved whatsoever in the murder of 270 innocent people in the Pan Am airliner over Lockerbie on December 21, 1988, I would not have agreed to pen an article - let alone an article sympathetic to al-Megrahi. My deep conviction, as a “professor of Lockerbie studies” over a 20-year period is that neither al-Megrahi nor Libya had any role in the destruction of Pan Am 103.

I believe they were made a scapegoat in 1990-91 by an American government that had decided to go to war with Iraq and did not want complications with Syria and Iran, which had harboured the real perpetrators of the terrible deed. Libya and its “operatives”, Al-Amin Khalifa Fhimah (al-Megrahi's co-accused) and al-Megrahi, only came into the frame at a very late date. In my informed opinion, al-Megrahi has been the victim of one of the most spectacular (and expensive) miscarriages of justice in history.

It is an opinion shared by those who have come to know al-Megrahi, the man - his two excellent solicitors, Eddie McKechnie, who successfully defended Mr Fhimah and who took on al-Megrahi's case after the decision that he was guilty, and Tony Kelly, the enormously hard-working and thorough solicitor who is now acting for al-Megrahi. It is an opinion shared by the Rev John Mosey and Dr Jim Swire, who both lost much-loved daughters and who attended virtually every day of the trial in the Netherlands. I must also add that it is an opinion shared by one of the staff at Barlinnie who met al-Megrahi when he was a prisoner there and whom I knew in another context as member of parliament for West Lothian.

Visiting him in prison, I was struck by his self-possession - a self-possession that had struck many people at his trial, possibly because it never occurred to him that he would be found guilty. It explains my passionate involvement over 20 years, as well as that of Robert Black, professor emeritus of Scots law at the University of Edinburgh. It was on our say-so that Libya ever surrendered its citizens to Scottish justice. Whatever happens to al-Megrahi, faced with advanced terminal cancer, the case will continue because on trial is the international reputation of Scottish justice and particularly of the Crown Office, which not only suppressed information that it knew should have been given to the defence, but told an outright lie to the heavyweight distinguished judge, John Lord Coulsfield, when he asked whether they had confidence in their leading witness, Tony Gauci, a Maltese shopkeeper.

The Crown assured him that they did have such confidence. Years later the lord advocate of the day said in public that Mr Gauci was not the full shilling. If they did that, how could they have given their word to Coulsfield?

It was a colossal error of judgment not to allow al-Megrahi to speak for himself in the dock at his trial at Camp Zeist. Had he done so, the judges would surely have had a flavour of the type of man he was and might have jaloused that he was not likely to be a mass murderer. Some of us said then that there ought to have been a Muslim judge and al-Megrahi has often said to me since and to his lawyers that it would have been fair to have an international tribunal rather than one country acting as prosecutor, judge and executor of the punishment.

Al-Megrahi was born into the same tribe as one of Colonel Muammar Gaddafi's most trusted lieutenants. He was educated at Benghazi University at the engineering school held in high regard by the engineers of Brown and Root and their chairman, the late Sir Dick Morris. Al-Megrahi was proud of the traditional skills associated with his people.

Had the judges had the opportunity to get to know the man, they would never have arrived at the verdict that he was guilty of mass murder. He is a civilised, intelligent, caring man. At the very least, the judges would have arrived at the verdict of “not proven”.

Almost the last thing that al-Megrahi said to me was: “Yes, of course I want to go back to Tripoli. I have my wife and my five children are growing up, but I want to go back an innocent man.”

Some of us are determined to find the truth and justice that we believe will find him innocent.

The author is a former Labour MP for Linlithgow and Father of the House of Commons
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/article5058606.ece
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Great Spirit, grant that I may not criticize my neighbor until I have walked a mile in his moccasins." - Old Native American Indian Prayer that my dad taught me.

... And Justice For All · Joined: 27 Oct 2008 Posts: 58

Dalyell said :

It was on our say-so [Bob Black's and his] that Libya ever surrendered its citizens to Scottish justice.

Indeed it was Mr Dalyell ... And that Scottish justice has served those Libyan citizens (and their own) very well over the years of course.

The Megrahi bandwagon, self-promotion (by many out there it seems), guilt and self-aggrandizement goes on, and on, and on...
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Latest News on Megrahi :

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en...r+Al+Megrahi&btnG=Search+News

____________________

Dignity and Justice for All of Us ... including all those Scottish nationals, those many unseen victims of injustice, currently suffering under Scotland's greatly discredited justice system
_________________
When injustice becomes law, rebellion and protest becomes duty

Justice Is Lost, Justice Is Raped, Justice Is Gone. Pulling Your Strings, Justice Is Done. Seeking No Truth, Winning Is All... In Scotland's "Justice" System

kevin donald · Joined: 29 Oct 2007 Posts: 198

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Dignity and Justice for All of Us ... including all those Scottish nationals, those many unseen victims of injustice, currently suffering under Scotland's greatly discredited justice system
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Well said ...And justice for all.

I know what you mean about the above quote, Somedays i feel like packing it all in and letting the lawyers deal with things but then i think of what Brendan is going through and what Lord Hardie put all my family through.

I will never give up and dont need all the people that i contacted media and others who would not help, But when the tide turns and the case gets interesting to them they can go boil their heids.

I think it is a disgrace that people dont care and turn a blind eye to injustice i wish it would happen to them to see how they react to it and to show it can happen to anyone.

I have said it before Scotland needs one all together organization to deal with All types of injustice one that is charity funded or from fundraising.

ALL TOGETHER WE MIGHT STAND A CHANCE BECAUSE AT THE MOMENT WE DONT.

scotkaz · Joined: 28 Aug 2008 Posts: 527

Kevin

I know what it is like to feel like no one is listening. But little by little people are listening and looking into cases.

I checked the Killie 2 site this morning and in the past month there have been almost 300 people on the site looking at the information. Now I know that is not that many in the grand scheme of things but its a good start.

The sad thing is many people do not get involved because it just does not affect their lives. Its only when it does that they realise how difficult it is to get support.

The struggles are difficult I know but out there in the world there are people who do care and who will help. Little by litte people are hearing about Brendan and Patricks terrible case.

Perseverance is the key, and look no further than how long Big Wullie has persevered and never given up. I hope the Killie 2's fight is not as long or anyone else's fight for that matter.

We need to get as much information on the Killie case as possible out there for people to read. If you have any more could you please send me it? Thanks

Stay strong!!

Karen x
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Great Spirit, grant that I may not criticize my neighbor until I have walked a mile in his moccasins." - Old Native American Indian Prayer that my dad taught me.

... And Justice For All · Joined: 27 Oct 2008 Posts: 58

Hello Kevin

Thank you for your comments above.

I have read about your and your family's struggle for Brendan and can fully understand your frustrations. TRUTH and JUSTICE certainly doesn't come swiftly or easily when battling against such an incestuous and corrupt Scottish justice system at every level ... especially one that the SNP government are NOT GOING TO CHANGE for the better ... there are simply too many vested interests at stake, not least right at MacAskill's door ... as you surely all must know and accept by now. He, Salmond and the SNP government are complicit in a lot of the injustices we all seek to rectify.

You need to concentrate on having just the one website in my view - like Mr McKie has done re Shirley's case. There are, I feel, too many different blogs re Brendan's case. I can see you are trying very hard to get the case "out there" to as many people who will listen, support and help you, but it is simply too much of the same and you need just the one blog devoted to the case now and disseminate that one blog to the media, your many contacts and the masses.

My justified criticisms of the key players (those many self-promoters) in the never-ending Megrahi debacle merely serve to highlight the fact that those individuals shout loud and often about a specific foreign national, but remain completely SILENT about so many other alleged miscarriages of justice in Scotland today, and many other injustices well known to them too. If only Brendan's case had the same support from the supposed "great and good" in Scottish society, coupled with the huge publicity the Megrahi case gets daily, then I'm sure his case would be brought to a head sooner rather than later ... and the many other injustices highlighted on this forum, which we all know about by now ... but which are not getting the publicity and help they really merit.

You are right in what you say of course : most people don't really give a damn about injustice (in whatever form) unless and until it comes aknocking at their own door and bites them very hard in the ass! Sad, but true.

I would certainly donate to any charity that was set up along the lines you suggest, but would such a thing ever really work? Are there just not too many people with their own "injustice blogs" and self-serving agendas for such a charity to every become a reality? I suspect that may be the case now alas.

Maybe such an organisation could be called Dignity and Justice for All of Us ... in Scotland and beyond - or something along those lines ... I would need to get my thinking cap on to come up with an appropriate name, but it's a thought just now...

Could such an idea and dream ever become a reality, or are there just too many competing factions out there now jumping on the injustice bandwagon with their own self-promoting agendas? The cynic in me thinks that is now the case, but, like I said, I would certainly be willing to contibute to the setting up of such an organisation ... if we could ever get such a thing off the ground.

Try not to let Scotland's discredited and very corrupt INjustice system (and the many b******s within it!) get you down too much ... but I can fully understand the sheer frustration, anger and turmoil within. No-one can fully understand unless injustice rears its ugly head at their home ... NO-ONE.

My best wishes to you and yours.
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Latest News on Megrahi :

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en...r+Al+Megrahi&btnG=Search+News

____________________________________________________________

Dignity and Justice for All of Us ... including all those Scottish nationals, those victims of injustice, currently suffering under Scotland's greatly discredited justice system

_________________
When injustice becomes law, rebellion and protest becomes duty

Justice Is Lost, Justice Is Raped, Justice Is Gone. Pulling Your Strings, Justice Is Done. Seeking No Truth, Winning Is All... In Scotland's "Justice" System