shirleymckie.myfastforum.org

Pat A. Wertheim · Joined: 23 Apr 2007 Posts: 73 Location: USA

David Mulhern was offered an impossible job and accepted the challenge. He has failed.

The challenge was to scrap the old SCRO, in which the public in Scotland had completely lost confidence, and build a new police support agency imbued with ethics and expertise. This new agency would be able to restore the confidence of the public and the courts.

Instead of scrapping the SCRO and starting over, however, Mr. Mulhern has simply put a new coat of red paint on a decaying barn. Old experts still stand by old erroneous identifications, still work for the “new” agency, and still testify as they always have. The fingerprints that will go down in history as the most controversial case in the first century of the use of fingerprints are kept in a closed file, locked away where the experts affected by them cannot even see them. Checks and balances that were supposed to be created through a “safeline,” a phone number a concerned employee could call to ask questions or report misfeasance or malfeasance among others in the agency, have been exposed as a sure-fire way to commit professional suicide. An example was made of the first person to use that “safeline,” Gary Dempster. The whole world knows now that the “safeline” is a fast way to end the caller’s career in humiliation and disgrace.

In his effort to prevent destroying morale by scrapping the SCRO and starting over, Mr. Mulhern has done the very thing he sought to avoid. He has perpetuated the very culture of arrogance that led to the public loss of confidence in the first place.

Although the formal announcement of the formation of the SPSA has been made, it is not too late to modify the “new” agency. The decision has been made not to tear down the old barn and start over, but the decaying parts can still be removed. New braces can still be put up to strengthen the structure. It is not too late to restore a little confidence in the system. But the SPSA as it has been restructured appears to be nothing but the old SCRO with a new coat of paint.

How can the Scottish public have any faith in that?

Big Wullie · Joined: 25 Apr 2007 Posts: 1149 Location: Glasgow

Pat I agree with you wholeheartedly.

The whole SCRO fiasco has left a bad taste in many a Scots mouth
I note from the SPSA release on their site the following:

I am confident that we have a national fingerprint service operating to internationally-recognised standards.
This strikes me as odd since Martin Leadbetter has calimed we in the UK have the better facilities for training our Fingerprint Experts yet they are striving for Internationally recognized standards ?
I also notice the following quotes from Arie Zeelenberg:

Arie Zeelenberg, Senior Fingerprint Adviser, Dutch National Police:
"At the same time I am of the opinion that through the choice not to investigate the mistaken identification and its causes in the McKie case, important opportunities are missed to learn from it.
Arie “Folks” is from the Netherlands and supported Shirley and SCRO have tried to label him a crank and not credible for years yet here he is helping them to try rebuild a crumbling SCRO (As Pat would Say SCRO with a new paint job)

In my view the choice to block access to the case for the staff is in conflict with the ambition of transparency and accountability. Full closure, which is also important for the international fingerprint community, is therefore not achieved and I regret this."

In the above Arie also slates them for not allowing these SCRO workers to view the print again and failing in the Transparency and Accountability stakes
But then again this has allowed the ones from SCRO who wrongly Identified Y7 as Shirley McKies to maintain their stance without scrutiny.
Lets hope Elish Angiolini discloses this to the next Enquiry, She is quoted as saying nothing will be held back but has a very bad track record of not releasing evidence in Court when clearly she is very well aware of the duty of disclosure.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x11rHMJskY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNb6ONidmc0

Lets hope the next enquiry will not accept the evidence of so called experts reeled out of 21 years of retirement to claim they had 48 years experience and all his experience was gained from the police.

Peter Swann gave evidence to the last Enquiry (held By Labour Controlled Parliament) and stated : It was Shirley's left thumb print and he used the top part for Identification purposes The SCRO four (McBride & Co) said it was her right thumb print and only a non expert would use the top part for Identification, So much for Swanns Evidence ?

We as lay persons would disregard Swann as a credible witness yet Crown Office used his evidence to back up the SCRO Four and as a reason not to charge any SCRO with Perjury, Very questionable indeed if you ask me, And what does it infer of Crown Office ?
Peter Swann rolled out of retirement does not have any IAI accreditation as far as I am aware, nor does he sit any competency tests to be able to give evidence in our Courts, yet he was allowed to give evidence at the last enquiry.

Peter Swanns evidence can be seen here:
He doesn't know how they can say it's a right thumb print

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DeqkQNvc7UQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkxp3MAnP1Q

Peter Swan used a print from the Daily mail for comparison:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuYPNQ9xUZA

Fiona McBride herslf actually told our Last Enquiry that she and she alone signed all the other workers Initials on Y7 as she knew they had looked at it before her.
And thank God she did because we wouldn't have any record of who had looked at it she said.
Very very suspicious if you ask me, Should they not put their own signatures on Legal Documents ?

Hear it for yourselves here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=soMhwDueLUs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UmtgzFZJho

Lets hope the next enquiry is not fobbed off with all the same crap the last one accepted.

My biggest concern though Pat is the fact that these people that wrongly Identified Y7 as Shirley's and the Asbury print that followed are still in denial and positions where they can do the same to another Innocent victim and therefore there remains the potential for more “Miscarriages Of Justice”

Until they can admit their mistakes Fingerprints as evidence in Scotland will remain open to challenge in our Courts.

Fingerprints will remain an untested science and under close scrutiny unless this enquiry concludes clear criminal intent from within SCRO to hide their mistakes.

Can't wait for the enquiry
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Big Wullie · Joined: 25 Apr 2007 Posts: 1149 Location: Glasgow

SCRO have insulted and tried to discredit all who did not agree with them.

Wonder what they will make of the comment here from McKay:

During interviews the four SCRO experts chose not to make
any comment.

This no comment coming from the SCRO four is strange as they keep saying they have been Gagged ?

This is what is expected from people who have been charged with a criminal offence, not SCRO workers giving evidence to a Police Enquiry.

15.8.8.18 During this enquiry, we were privy to suggestions and implied sinister
comment as to Shirley McKie's evidence and her being in the Ross
house. This is unfortunate and ill-conceived comment and (i) there is
no justifiable evidence to doubt Shirley McKie, and (ii) the entire Police
Service must now look objectively at fingerprint evidence and come to
terms that there have been two misidentifications by SCRO.

How will they manage to discredit his evidence, Come to terms there have been two Misidentifications by SCRO

Well Ms McBride anything to say in your defence

Pat I am concerned they will be allowed to refuse to give evidence, or take a sicky.

Will they be required to give evidence and answer every question put to them.

I understand one was sick and off work when Shirley went to trial therefore was not questioned on Oath and has remained silent throughout the whole fiasco

Iain McKie · Joined: 08 May 2007 Posts: 263 Location: Ayr, Scotland.

Pat,

You state.